re: Time to shut down this list?

From: Jeff Lewis (jlewis1957_at_netscape.net)
Date: 12/23/04

  • Next message: Ronald Maggio: "re: Time to shut down this list?" 
    Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:40:54 -0500
To: FreeBSD-newbies@FreeBSD.org, grog@FreeBSD.org, sue@welearn.com.au, wes@softweyr.com

    I'm a newbie, and until now, a lurker.

    I do not want this list disbanded. I believe that I belong here.

    I do like reading/learning from the questions asked/answered,
    and am mildly disappointed when I see the person referred to the
    -questions list. I understand the original charter of the list.

    I see little that truly DOES follow the charter.

    I do NOT however believe that I can "run with the big dogs" on the
    -questions list. The sheer volume alone makes it impossible for me
    to filter out what I will grasp (I am a lurker) as many of the
    questions are over my head, let alone the follow-up and answers.
    At best, I can only google for keywords when I have a question,
    or post one myself. I have posted on some Red Hat linux -questions
    lists with pretty sad results.

    I applaud you Greg for bringing this subject up as it really does
    need some discussion. And trying to stand in your shoes for just
    a moment, I appreciate your concern for folks asking questions
    and not getting answers, or worse, getting an incorrect answer
    from another newbie. And I thank you for that.

    I'd like to broaden the discussion, just a little.

    You suggested disbanding the list. I would suggest modifying the
    charter.

    I've tried several times to figure out how to word this question
    nicely, and it always comes off smug. It's not how I mean it, but
    here goes anyway.

    Who does this list serve?

    If it serves the Experienced by documenting the newbie experience or
    even just segregating newbie discussions, then your suggestion of
    disbanding the list may indeed be the right one. There doesn't seem
    to be alot of that happening here. We are noobs, just not prolific
    ones. <g>

    I will assume that you want all the Newbie questions on the -questions
    list rather than here because THAT is where those willing to take the
    time to answer them are. Not at all an unreasonable request.

    But if this list serves the Newbies, and we (the Newbies) would
    like to have questions answered here, then maybe it is time to modify
    the charter. The PROBLEM with this is that the relationship is a
    one-way symbiotic relationship. Newbies asking question won't get
    very far without the Willing Experienced.

    Perhaps the REAL underlying question to this whole discussion is,

              "What are we going to do with the Newbies?"
                                  - or -
              "What are we going to do for the Newbies?"

    And please note: the "WE" referenced above is an eclectic group of
    dedicated individuals that know FreeBSD and are willing spend time
    with those of us that don't know it. The ability and desire to teach
    is often a lot more difficult than you might think -- and doubly so
    on a mailing list where you cannot tell what the person's existing
    knowledge or background is.

    Wes Peters just posted the following question: "Come on, newbies,
    let's hear YOUR ideas on how to get better answers for your questions."

    Sir, I'd like to ask my newbie questions here and I really do
    appreciate hearing from experieced FreeBSD users. If this isn't
    feasible, then how can I ask question properly on the -questions list
    so that folks answering them will not assume that I understand alot.
    Prefixing the subject line with NEWBIE could work. Will it also mean
    that it will be ignored by most?

    Case in point:

    I just got my hardware ready. I will be loading 4.10 on my new test
    box. (5.2.1 hated the ACPI and required that I select NO ACPI from
    the menu all the time.) I wanted to mirror software that my ISP uses
    so I tried to find out what version of the OS they were running.

    It took me 20 minutes of googling to find the uname command. Then I
    had to find the same for perl and php (easier). I never did find out
    how to do this for apache.

    But I would never have asked that question on the -questions list
    because I felt stupid. I didn't ask that question here because we
    aren't supposed to.

    Jeff

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  • Next message: Ronald Maggio: "re: Time to shut down this list?"

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