Re: July the 4th

In article <1186010329.495752.168100@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, AEF <spamsink2001@xxxxxxxxx> writes:
On Aug 1, 6:15 pm, Dirk Munk <m...@xxxxxxx> wrote:
Ron Johnson wrote:
On 07/30/07 02:15, Dirk Munk wrote:
JF Mezei wrote:
AEF wrote:
It doesn't matter what the US does. Hamas, Hezbollah, etc., want to
destroy the state of Israel. THEY'VE PLAINLY AND LOUDLY SAID SO!
They acceptance of Israel's existance will be the RESULT of succesful
negotiations. The USA/Israel require them to accept Israel as a
pre-condition for negotiations.
The state of Israel exists since the UN more or less established it in
1948. The existence of the state of Israel or acceptance of this fact is
not negotiable.

Almost no one in the middle east is interested in solving the conflict
between Israel and the Palestinians. Why not? Simple, corrupt and
autocratic leaders love to use this conflict to distract their own
people from the problems in their own country. It is the oldest game in
politics, find something abroad to distract the attention of the people
from your own failures. And it works perfectly. Poverty in your own
country? Look at the Americans and Europeans! They help the Israeli
against the Palestinians! They hate Muslems! That is why we are poor!

Who is paying the salaries of the Palestinian civil servants? Not the
rich Arab countries or other "Muslem brother states". No, the US and the
EU, those damned friends of Israel.

A man after my own heart.

Are you *sure* that you are European? Or were you stolen at birth
from a Texas hospital and spirited across the pond?

Quite sure, thanks. :-)

There is no such thing as "the Palestinians". In recent times there has
never been a consolidated Palestinian leadership. There is Fatah, rotten
and corrupt to the core, and there is Hamas. The problem is that Hamas
is doing a lot of good things for the Palestinian people with money from
rather unpleasant Arab states. They have hospitals, social care, schools
and so on. In return they have to preach hatred against Israel and
destabilize any peace process. You get nothing for free. Besides these
two there are all kind of other Palestinians groups out of control by
the two main parties. In the middle of this is the poor Palestinian
people, and I do mean that. The average Palestinian man woman or child
hasn't seen peace or happiness in decades. Generations grew up in
misery. They are used as pawns in a very cynical political chess game.

Now Israel isn't doing very much to improve the situation either. If you
are a Palestinian or a Israeli citizen of Arab origin, and you can't get
water from the tap while Jewish people are splashing in their private
swimming pool just a few hundred yards from your home, you will not get
the idea that you get treated fairly by the Israeli government. And this
is just a small example of the rather foolish way Israel is fueling the
conflict.

This is interesting and sad. Do you have a reference, so that I
might get more detail?

Now you know why I am from Europe and not the US. The Netherlands have
always strongly supported Israel in its struggle to survive, and that
included for instance sending Patriot missiles to Israel during the
first Gulf war. I totally agree with this all. However we also see that
Israel is not treating its Arab citizens or the Palestinians the way it
should, far from it. That is what we also get to see on television and
in newspapers over here, not just pro Israel talk. The water problem is
just a very small example. Israel does numerous unnecessary small things
(and big things as well) that make life for Arabs very unpleasant. In

Can you please give some detail on this water problem? If you're
talking about when Israel was still in Gaza, well, they're out now.
The Gazans can have that water all to themselves. If not, please do
tell.

And what are all these things to make life unpleasant for its Arab
population?

Also, the Palestinians (or whatever you choose to call them -- I see
your point, but we have to call them something!) have had several
chances to have their own state and blew every single one. I also love
how whenever Israel "withdrew" from the West bank the P's violence
against Israel increased. Not a real good incentive for the Israelis
leave!

the end this attitude will backfire and Israel will regret this stupidity.

By the way, did you know that not even all Jews are treated equal in
Israel? There are 'classes' of Jews, it all depends where your family
came from. Did they come from some poor underdeveloped country, and they
hardly had any education? Then you are a second class Jew I'm afraid.

Never heard of this. Can you elaborate? Just exactly how are they
treated differently?


see for instance

http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51a/093.html

(This is mostly about the Palestinians but you can ignore that if you wish and
look towards the end about the stratification of Jewish society. Ethiopian and
Yemeni Jews being at the bottom of Jewish society).

David Webb
Security team leader
CCSS
Middlesex University


AEF

.

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