Re: An OS for an Alpha? (was: To: Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER)

From: GM (logquality_at_hotmail.com)
Date: 09/29/05

  • Next message: mark_hpq_at_yahoo.com: "HP : Moving forward" 
    Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 17:55:28 GMT

    You guys rock...

    I'm really beginning to Luv ...hating this ***

    In a perverse sort of way It's now my mission in life to get a GUI Based OS
    up-and-running on this steam powered ....boat anchor.

    Well........off to the store........I need another 50 CD's......

    Hugs and Kisses....

    GM

    "Hoff Hoffman" <hoff@hp.nospam> wrote in message
    news:dlV_e.13472$Vf2.8687@news.cpqcorp.net...
    > In article <tRL_e.91$z26.71@edtnps84>, "GM" <logquality@hotmail.com>
    writes:
    > :I dl'd a copy of gentoo linux and made a floppy of some milo stuff. It
    > :actually flashed and squeaked and sputtered and after 15 minutes I got
    a...
    > :#
    > :
    > :some kinda command line ***.
    >
    > Most UNIX systems will drop you into the Bash, csh, sh, ksh, or
    > one of various other command shells. OpenVMS likes to drop you
    > into DCL and to the $ prompt; into the OpenVMS "command shell".
    >
    > :No desktop, no nothin.
    >
    > Most operating systems are command line -- it's easier to automate, far
    > more flexible, and faster. Unfortunately, a command line interface is
    > far more cryptic, particularly if you are largely accustomed to a WIMP
    > (Windows, Icons, Menus, Pulldowns) interface. Most every WIMP is
    > built onto a command shell, too -- as the system bootstraps, the
    > command shell is active, and eventually the WIMP is then launched.
    >
    > WIMP can and usually does work best when you are unfamiliar with the
    > platform and/or command-line interfaces. WIMP tends to get in the
    > way when you are automating tasks, replicating systems, or performing
    > other similar tasks.
    >
    > (And if most of what you see for information displayed on a Graphical
    > User Interface is text, I am not at all certain why we call the the
    > display mechanism a GUI. But I digress.)
    >
    > :I'd luv to install freeBSD but after downloading it ....the genius who
    says
    > :*copy these image files to a floppy
    > :
    > :well ........HOW... they are .flp images
    >
    > dd, probably. There is probably a dd port for whatever system
    > you are hosting the download. There's probably a discussion of
    > this in the FreeBSD documentation, too.
    >
    > :The problem with Linux is.... people who build it....don't know just how
    > :DUMB us wintel morons are.
    >
    > Every operationg system has a "cost of entry" in terms of the
    > knowledge required to get it going. When you're downloading and
    > tossing images around, well, you tend to be on the bleeding edge.
    >
    > In the case of Red Hat or Fedora Core Linux, for instance, the
    > DVD distro does have a WIMP-like installation environment.
    >
    > Getting to the distro is the interesting part.
    >
    > :No wonder M$ is winning........you Gotta have a freakin degree just to
    > :install these so called FREE OS's.
    >
    > TANSTAAFL. "There ain't no such thing as a free lunch", to
    > quote from Mr. Heinlein's _The Moon is a Harsh Mistress_.
    >
    > A download-based installation of Microsoft Windows is not
    > necessarily fun, either -- and the easiest approach assumes
    > you have a BIOS that can boot from USB or CD-ROM, and not
    > all BIOS implementations can do that.
    >
    > :My new Vocabulary of the week:
    > :
    > :MILO.......a Canine mascot affiliated with FreeBSD or NetBSD
    >
    > MILO and LILO are boot loaders, and work reasonably nicely.
    > Windows has an analog, too, that appears when you have two or
    > more versions of Windows loaded. The boot loaders can load
    > most operating systems, for those systems that support and
    > that are configured with multiple operating systems.
    >
    > With an Alpha system, the SRM console is the boot loader.
    > (That's the cryptic BOOT command, among other commands.)
    > With Itanium systems, you'll see EFI used as the boot loader.
    > The capabilities of a computer system with "only" a classic
    > BIOS implementation -- rather than something like EFI (UEFI)
    > or SRM -- can be and often must be supplemented with the
    > construct known as a bootloader.
    >
    > :Floppy Image.....A Photo of a Floppy disk
    >
    > Don't forget to save your original floppy on the refrigerator.
    > Use a kitchen magnet to hold it there. Sorry. Old joke. :-)
    >
    > :Boot DKA400 -flags0.........secret code to access my cd-rom
    >
    > From SRM, the incantation for a bootstrap from a disk on the fourth
    > SCSI unit on the first SCSI bus is, and overriding any default
    > flags settings and specifying the primary OpenVMS root and with no
    > boot flags specified, is:
    >
    > >>> boot dka400 -flags 0,0
    >
    > :Is there any........any..........OS that I can download and
    burn.........An
    > :ISO.........and put it in the CD-rom in the Alpha server........and
    > :.....and........it works.........
    >
    > You could order a hobbyist disk kit for OpenVMS for about US$30.
    > The distro can be ordered at <http://www.openvmshobbyist.org/>
    >
    > I'm not aware of generally-accessable hobbyist media disk images
    > for OpenVMS, nor -- given the copyrights and software licensing
    > for the product -- would I tend to expect to find open download
    > access to same.
    >
    > Oh, and in addition to the discussions of the problems reading
    > writeable or rewriteable media on older CD-ROM drives, also don't
    > assume that a downloaded disk image gets burned correctly -- a
    > raw, binary, block-by-block, ISO (a very ambiguous term, BTW) or
    > whatever the particular software package calls the necessary data
    > transfer operation isn't necessarily as easy as you might thing,
    > want, or hope. Failures here tend to be subtle, and something
    > that is best tangled with once you have some familiarity with the
    > area and the platform -- if your goal is to get an operating system
    > booted up and running with a minimum of intervention, acquiring a
    > a pre-built distro kit (DVD or CD, depending on requirements) will
    > be faster, and will be easier. (As you have certainly found here,
    > the download and replication and installation can be the most painful
    > part of the whole home-grown installation process.)
    >
    > As for a general introduction to the process within OpenVMS itself
    > -- the other side of creating an installable and bootable kit for
    > optical media -- do see the discussion in the OpenVMS Ask The Wizard
    > topic 9820. <http://h71000.www7.hp.com/wizard/wiz_9820.html> The
    > initial generation and the mastering for replication does have some
    > specific requirements, and there are ways to generate non-bootable
    > optical media -- to generate costers, in the common parlance.
    >
    > --
    >
    > The OpenVMS FAQ has various information and pointers associated with
    > OpenVMS, and is available at the URL:
    >
    > <http://www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq/>
    >
    >
    >
    > ---------------------------- #include
    <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------
    > For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ --
    www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq
    > --------------------------- pure personal
    opinion ---------------------------
    > Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman OpenVMS Engineering hoff[at]hp.com
    >

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