Re: No longer supporting Unixware / Open Server

From: Brian K. White (brian_at_aljex.com)
Date: 01/31/04 

Date: 30 Jan 2004 19:40:00 -0800

bv@wjv.comREMOVE (Bill Vermillion) wrote in message news:<HsBI93.1LGI@wjv.com>...
> In article <cz2Sb.179512$na.292957@attbi_s04>,
> Joe Dunning <joedunning1234_removethis@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >On 28 Jan 2004 19:47:26 -0800, Brian K. White <brian@aljex.com> wrote:
>
> >>joe@blahblah.invalid (Joe Dunning) wrote in message
> >news:<soXRb.46152$U%5.240446@attbi_s03>...
>
> >>> On 28 Jan 2004 10:42:47 -0800, Brian K. White
> >>> <brian@aljex.com> wrote:
>

> >>and to highly customize their linux installations to minimize those
> >>vagaries in the first place. The "technical justifications" are many
> >>and I rarely get past the first one or two before a client decides
> >>"Never mind I don't need that!" in those instances when they ask me to
> >>explain our particular choice of OS.
>
> That sounds like the customers needs vs wants were not specified
> before the installation started. That's not a good way to go with
> any OS, but I have seen many customers that start out that way.
> Part of my job I feel is discussing with the customer so everything
> is known beforehand.

The conversations I refer to above ARE taking place long before any
actual action. This is typically during the very very first
demonstrations and pre-sales info gathering. But also, once in a while
a long-time already existing client who never cared before and doesn't
really care now so long as the job is getting done, will ask me about
it just out of curiosity.

>
> >> Yes, I do tell them the PRO's as well as the cons, no I do not
> >>invent or even exagerate the cons, yes I have used and continue
> >>to use linux myself enough to be quite knowledgeable about it
> >>from first hand experience.
>
> >So we are to believe that you honestly tell your customers about the
> >pros and cons of Linux vs. SCO yet you also state that:
> >>> >.... I refuse to allow linux into the professional
> >>> >work environments I'm responsible for?
>
> >These two statements cannot be reconciled. You have shown your true
> >attitude here: you have some irrational bias against Linux and you are
> >most likely doing your customers a disservice when you advise them.
>
> All Brian said was that he refuse to allow it in the environments
> for which he's responsible. That's not much difference from
> someone who has a bias saying "I will never own a Ford" [or
> whatever the object of derision will be].

Actually, I have never said "never". I used to use it a lot, I have
used it here and there in production, and have decided it's OK but
there just happens to be something superior available and as long as
that is true, I feel it's my duty to the customer to give them what I
honestly judge to be what is best for them. That also implies a duty
to stay current and be as widely knowledgeable as possible so that
"what I judge to be best for them" is in fact based on current
practical issues rather than emotions or practical issues that are no
longer true. So I continue to use and watch linux and redhat's history
is a perfect example of why even today, even with all the crap sco is
pulling, I still install new sco boxes. I could probably make linux
work farly well, but it would end up having to be by starting with
some particular distribution, modifying it a little maybe for our
needs, and then from then on maintaining it as our own distribution
instead of accepting the changes to the parent distribution. That
might not be all that horrible... but, I don't have to do that with
sco, so moving to that model is not a win. I'm basically trying to do
something like that with freebsd, but I just happen to be more
comfortable putting freebsd-style-developed code out in the field than
linux-style.

> He's not doing them a dis-service if they want him to work for them
> and he's not comfortable working in that environment. If the
> customer wants Linux and he doesn't care to support it, he should
> point them to someone who does.

The problem usually comes from the customer already having someone
they think they like who talks them into linux. So they are not
looking for recommendations or support at first except for us to
install our software on their new linux box. What happens is their
linux guy turns out to be about exactly like the grocery-bagger-by-day
"NT experts" I'm sure we've all encountered. I end up having to
"support linux" because by the time the customers gets hit with some
problem it is too late for warnings and it is utterly unhelpful to say
"Well I told you so", and they really just need their existing linux
box made to work because they are hanging on a hook by then and it
doesn't matter at that point that they made the hook themselves.
Unless I actually think I wouldn't do a good job then I have to admin
the box myself.

Relevant Pages

  • Cool: Windows is Cheaper, Windows is Secure
    ... You may have seen a letter from Steve Ballmer, CEO of Microsoft, which was ... sent to all Windows customers in an attempt to slow the flood of migration ... Group report ("Linux, UNIX and Windows TCO Comparison"). ...
    (microsoft.public.windows.server.sbs)
  • Re: lets vote for better security
    ... How many times have you been said linux ... this is a ploy to lie to customers. ... > A frequent Microsoft explanation for why they did something a certain way ... It was found that all browsers except IE ...
    (microsoft.public.security)
  • Re: Are you supporting SCO?
    ... Let the customers decide. ... customers using SCO products. ... How many would you suspect have decided to abandon SCO ... Moving to Linux has always been an option, ...
    (comp.unix.sco.misc)
  • Re: ready to use debian or ubuntu laptop reccomendations?
    ... They advertise it on their website, but Dell will not, under any circumstance, sell you a preinstalled Linux box. ... The typical Dell customer doesn't want to know about apt-get this or dpkg that or Sarge, Etch, multiverse, universe, etc. Typical Dell customers will think their computers are broken when they refuse to play a particular .wmv file they found in a Yahoo! ... Dell and Novell today announced an agreement to offer Novell SUSE LINUX Enterprise Server 9 certified on select Dell PowerEdge servers worldwide. ...
    (Debian-User)
  • Re: freebox possible GPL violation
    ... If I lend customers linux boxes, ... >webmaster patch the code of his own webserver to provides his customers ... Nobody need to make another linux kernel from scratch, ...
    (Linux-Kernel)